Chrissy 0:00
Welcome to The Dogs of our lives. Podcast with me. Chrissy Messick, this is where traditional training transforms into true connection and understanding with our dogs. As a certified dog trainer, behavior consultant and interspecies communicator with a background in high level sports medicine, I bring a unique functional approach to understanding our dogs by integrating body, mind, heart and soul, join us for insights, stories and practical wisdom that will help you prevent problems before they start and build a deeper bond with your animal companion. Before we get into today's episode, let me ask you a question, how well do you actually know your dog? Why not take my quiz to find out? You can find the link in the show notes. Now let's dig in. Today. I'm talking with Jolie wingerson, who is a professional animal communicator and has been doing this for the past 24 years. And in fact, she was my first teacher, and I received my first animal communication certification from her class seven years ago. Although this is a little bit of a controversial subject, there is more and more research coming out to validate what people have been doing for many years. And in this episode, we talk about the many questions surrounding animal communication, how it works, the science behind it, ways to get started, a shift that's happening in the world right now and so much more. It's a little bit of a different episode, but I'm interested to hear your thoughts and questions. Welcome JoLee,
JoLee 1:23
Hi, Chrissy, it's so good to be here.
Chrissy 1:26
Yeah, thank you for coming on. And I think this is going to be a intriguing conversation for many people, and I think there's a big shift happening right now, so I think this is part of it. And so I feel like this is like good timing, and I think we're going to have a fun conversation. I do too. Do you want to just tell us a little bit about yourself and where you live, and I guess what you're doing?
JoLee 1:53
Well, I live in Boulder, Colorado, and I'm an animal communicator. I do work with all kinds of pets, mostly cats and dogs, but horses and birds and the occasional snake or reptilian as well. I really, if it's a pet, I'm interested. So that's my that's what I do. That's what I've been doing for, gosh, 24 years. Amazing.
Chrissy 2:24
Well, we know each other because I was it eight years ago. Now, I think I kind of was led to working with animals, because I've worked previously with, you know, the athletic population and sports medicine, yes. And so I was kind of going on a different path, just having kids, and it was just looking different. And so I was kind of trying to figure out what I wanted to do. I started volunteering at the Humane Society, so working in that area, but then also it led me to kind of animal communication and that kind of thing. And so that's how I found psychic horizons. And started with the heal yourself program, and then moving on to, you know, the animal communication, and that's where I met you, yes, and so that's kind of how we know each other. And so I started learning from you.
JoLee 3:17
You're an excellent student, Chrissy, you always have great questions, and you're very enthusiastic
Chrissy 3:24
anyway. So you've been doing this forever, like you said, 24 years. Do you just want to tell us a little bit how you got started in your journey along this path? Yes,
JoLee 3:33
well, so I, like many people, talked with animals as a child. That's just a very normal thing. I knew what they were thinking, I knew what they were feeling, mostly I knew what they were feeling, but I thought everybody knew that. I had no idea that that wasn't a common thing. I thought even adults had that experience. That was just a love I had of animals. My grandparents had a farm, and I enjoyed talking with animals, both wild and domesticated, and that was just normal. I had never considered it as a profession. I didn't know it was a profession. I didn't know other people couldn't do it, and but once I became an adult, I realized people couldn't do it because my grandparents horse told me he didn't want to be ridden anymore because he was older. I was like, Okay, I won't ride too anymore. Yes, you're retired, as far as I'm concerned, but other people continue to ride him, and that really confounded me, like, didn't you get the message and but they didn't. So it did kind of dawn on me that maybe other people didn't have that ability. But still, I went and I just had a normal career in banking, and I was a writer, and I had a spiritual journey that was very interesting to me, and as I explored more and more of that spiritual journey. Me, I was led to psychic Horizon Center in Boulder. Took the how to heal yourself class and some of and the Clairvoyant class, and that was just part of my journey. I had no interest in being a clairvoyant. People had told me I was highly intuitive, but I was like, Well, what does that mean? But I was very interested in this clairvoyant program? Well, there was an animal communication class in one of those classes. It was a year long program. In that animal communication class, we not only communicated with animals, but there was also the following Friday, or I guess it was Saturday, a healing clinic for pets, and I got to communicate with them and heal them. I was taken. That's all it was. The most fun thing I thought I had ever done, and I was that's all I could think about, was the animal communication stuff. But I still had no idea it was a profession, until I happened to be somewhere. I didn't have a TV I was somewhere, and I saw Sonia Fitzpatrick, a very famous animal communicator on Animal Planet, and here was this whole auditorium full of people, and she was giving readings, and the people were loving it. And I thought, it's a profession. That's what I want to do. And I never, I never looked back. That was just it. And with my clairvoyant training, I had enough experience and information to be able to be just start out as an animal communicator. I got my business cards, and I started right after that.
Chrissy 6:41
I've been doing it, yeah, and you're teaching, you're teaching people now,
JoLee 6:45
I do. I've been teaching about 10 years. Well, I've taught off and on. I've kind of taught. I taught at psyche horizons, way back right after I became an animal communicator. I taught classes there, and then I taught a few classes on my own, but I've been teaching a four month class twice a year for 10 years, and that's just where I am so excited. There's so many more animal communicators out in the world that are helping all of these people with their pets, with their relationships. And it's just everybody benefits from having more animal communicators in the world, and it's become much more popular. Back when I started in 2001 people would ask me what I did, and I'd tell them, and they'd say, what's that? It really it just was not a thing where now everybody knows what it is, so because it's so popular because animals have needs, and because it's so much fun to do, there's just a great, a great interest in it. So more and more animal communicators are needed,
Chrissy 7:52
yeah, when you said the Clairvoyant program, I took that program too. So how to heal yourself? And then I think I took the Clairvoyant program and then the animal communication program. I can't remember the order. I don't either. Yeah, taking those and learning from you. And boy, it's, it's definitely a journey.
JoLee 8:12
Yes, it is a journey. Yeah, it's
Chrissy 8:15
definitely a journey. Yeah, more and more people are doing it. And as a dog trainer and behavior consultant, it, there's a lot of skepticism in that, you know, in that world, but there are some people that you know, definitely believe in it, but I think people have had conflicting experiences, you know, on in both ways. So that's something that we can talk about. We'll talk about that. Okay? I think it's fascinating, and it's something that everybody can do, and we'll talk about that as well. Yes, I'm getting too excited. I'm getting off track here. That's alright. So can you tell us what animal communication, or intuitive interspecies communication, is, and how it works? Just in a kind of a nutshell?
JoLee 9:00
Sure, the main thing with animal communication is that people tap into pictures or words, and so animals can communicate both ways, through thoughts, telepathic thoughts that can translate through words or telepathic pictures, that you actually see an image. And so most animals are pretty adept at doing both. I don't know how that works from their end, but I just know they're really good at it, and they're doing it all the time. They think we're a little slow, because they are sending all these messages all the time, and we're pretty oblivious to a lot of them. So with animal communication and interspecies and intuitive interspecies communication, people are tapping in to what's our. Happening. So animals are already sending these messages, and their animals are surprised often that you can hear me, you can can understand me. Oh my gosh. This is great. They get very excited. So it's really people getting into that flow of communication that's going on all around us all the time. It's just learning to tune in. So it's like a radio station. You're just turning in, tuning into that frequency and picking up the information that's happening. And then it becomes a two way. You become like a walkie talkie?
Chrissy 10:42
Yeah, people get information different ways, and some people get it better with hearing things or just knowing things or seeing words, yes. So I think it depends on the person, you know, yeah, how they receive that information,
JoLee 11:00
yes, and a lot of people like me, when I was young, I received it through a feeling. I know how animals felt. I could feel their sadness, I could feel their excitement. It was a feeling that is very accurate. A lot of people have that ability. From my opinion and my experience, being able to see pictures tells you a lot more than either words or feeling or knowing. And so I tend to I teach people to see clairvoyantly to see pictures. It's like one picture is worth 1000 words. And so that's how I think I receive the most information. I think that's how a lot of people receive the most information. But all of those ways of receiving information are valid, yeah. And I think
Chrissy 11:53
some skeptics, skeptics out there, will say, Well, how do you know it's not your own feeling or your own information that you that you're getting, you know, how do you know it's just not all in your head? And I think a huge part of learning how to do animal communication is learning. That's why you take how to heal yourself and the clinic program is so you learn how to become neutral and get out of your own way. Then you know that the information that you're getting is not coming from yourself,
JoLee 12:22
that's right, and also just by validation. It's through practice and experience and then getting validation that, oh, I got this information, and somebody says, Oh, well, that's because whatever is the truth, and once you start seeing that the information, actually, if you think it's your imagination, you think it's something you're making up, but you start to see that, oh, I couldn't have known that. And that's that came through. Isn't that interesting? That was the truth. So it's through practice and experience,
Chrissy 12:59
yeah. And I remember, I remember you'd always laugh at me because I needed so much validation, because I was so
JoLee 13:07
Oh, everybody does. Everybody needs a lot of validation. That's part of it.
Chrissy 13:11
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I remember this one time we did a little exercise, and I was, like, with the pineapple and the rose. And I don't know if you remember that me and somebody else did it together, but anyway, it was just, I was like, Okay, I can't deny that, you know,
JoLee 13:28
yes, exactly you really, because the images come through in really unusual ways. And so, and there's a lot of our spirit, you know, wants us to get this so our spirit's working hard to help us trust and and get that validation right.
Chrissy 13:51
And sometimes you get information, or I get, I think this happens with a lot of people, but you get information and you're like, Oh, should I really say this like sense to me, but anyway, and then it ends up making sense for the person that's
JoLee 14:08
right, and I do a lot of that. There are many cases where I'm I don't know this is what the information is coming through and it doesn't make any sense, but they get it,
Chrissy 14:24
yeah, yeah. Or information that they're like that doesn't resonate, and then six months down the road, they're like, oh, this, this happened. And yeah, that happens to me a lot. And I'm like, oh, I need to get better at asking, like, is this now or is this in the future?
JoLee 14:45
Exactly, yes,
Chrissy 14:47
yeah. Like, really learning how to interpret the information,
JoLee 14:52
interpreting the information is an art. Yes. And every like you say, everybody receives information differently. Everyone. Has their own unique way of interpreting the information they get and and how they get it. And animals. Some animals show lots of pictures. Some animals are more verbal. So it's like again, like tuning in to that particular animal with their communication skills, and then with me and my communication abilities, so that there's a good communication flow. And it it takes practice. Practice is the practice and trusting yourself are the two primary keys to good animal communication. Yeah,
Chrissy 15:37
just like any skill that you learn, playing the violin or playing the piano. It's a skill, and you have to practice it.
JoLee 15:43
That's right. Practice, practice. That's right. And really, everybody has the ability. Everybody has a pineal gland and that center of headspace everybody has that. Everyone is genetically equipped to do animal communication, it's a matter, but it's like playing the piano. Some people have more affinity for it than others, but everyone can do it. You
Chrissy 16:08
know, playing basketball, some people are just equipped to play basketball really well. Yes, I could play basketball, but I'm not very good. You know,
JoLee 16:17
sure. Yeah, me too.
Chrissy 16:20
So with the pineal gland, are you saying that information comes through the pineal gland? Well,
JoLee 16:25
maybe not for everybody, but that is, it's a physical eye, and it is the center of headspace, and it is where people get information, and it's part of how people are able to interpret information,
Chrissy 16:44
and that's probably a talk for another time.
JoLee 16:50
Biology, yeah, that's about all I know. I've I've said about all I know about on that.
Chrissy 16:55
So a lot of people are curious. You know, with dog training and behavior, people will ask, well, how does, how can you help a dog that's showing behavior issues through animal communication? How does that work with behavior issues or medical issues or lost animals, or healing that kind of stuff?
JoLee 17:15
Exactly? Well, every session is unique, so even the same, even multiple sessions with one animal there, it's still going to be individual for that one a lot of behavior, I can't say a lot, but a good proportion of behavior issues come from misunderstanding animals just don't get it. So I have a story about a dog. I was reading three Irish setters, many, many. This is right when I started. And we spent most of time on two Irish setters. And I don't remember what we talked about with them, but the third Irish setter, the people said he's a perfect dog, except every morning at 430 he barks at the delivery the newspaper delivery guy wakes us up. And so I was like, well, and we only had like, five minutes left during our session. And so I was like, Okay, this dog's name was Tommy, very sweet boy, and I checked in with him. He's like, Yeah, what's going on? He says there's this intruder that comes every day, and he was very upset about it. And he says he comes while they're sleeping, and this is just, you know, they need to know about it, and it's happening every day. And I said, okay, so he was doing his job. He's like, Yeah, so I bark, and I wake him up, and then they get up, and then they're really angry because this intruder was there, but I did my job, so he was very content with everything that was going on. And so I said, Oh, Tommy. I said, this man is someone your people asked to come. They know he's coming. He is bringing them something that they value and that they would like you to let them sleep so they also value their sleep, so your barking does not make him go away. He's going to go away anyway. He is just there to drop this paper off, and then he leaves. And your people are angry because you're barking, and they would like you to be silent. And so that's, you know, what's going on. And I had a lot of compassion for and he was just incredulous. I mean, he just couldn't believe that that was a real story. And so and I told his people, I said, you need to kind of validate this. And, you know, tell him, show him the paper that the guy brings. And, well, he never barked at the delivery guy again. And I didn't hear that from the people, but they referred me to a. Million people, because it changed his behavior a little five minute, little kind of hate. This is what's going on. And I talked to all kinds of their friends who validated that he never barked at the delivery guy again. So depending on what's going on in an animal's head, can really help once they understand things. I mean, animals are confused about all kinds of stuff that has to do with people and their lives and then and healing can be so helpful, because that can sometimes it's a if they're a rescued animal, that there's their triggers. Or healing can really help a lot of situations where they're not able to control their behavior, medical issues, if somebody's a good medical intuitive can help a lot. A lot of times, vets are just really they don't know what's going on. And a good medical intuitive can really help. I'm not a medical intuitive. People that work with lost pets are invaluable because they can pinpoint. They can get a map out and say your pet is right here. So, I mean, that's what people want to know. And I've worked with some animal communicators that work with lost pets. I don't work with lost pets who have been highly, highly accurate and have brought the animals home. Animal communicators can help people in multiple ways, with all kinds of issues and sometimes just relationships. You know, it's just like, there's just something off, or, I wish they'd stop doing this, you know, annoying thing, and they are open to negotiation. They just don't know, and their people don't know how to negotiate with them or how to communicate. So it can be very, very helpful in many cases,
Chrissy 21:49
yeah, not only misunderstanding the animal is understanding, but also the humans misunderstanding. Absolutely.
JoLee 21:55
They don't know where their animals coming from. They don't know why they're doing it. And once they understand that, oh, that pet, you know, thinks that this is whatever, then once they understand or that this pet is dealing with something that is a involuntary response, they're not able to really control their body. I get that a lot with puppies. Puppy is a puppy for two years or more, but their body grows into a full grown animal after about a year, and people expect them to start acting like a full grown animal after a year, and it's like there's still a puppy. They can't control their body yet. So even though they look like they're full grown, they're not. And so just for people to understand that, oh, they can't do what I'm asking yet, they still need to mature. Yeah,
Chrissy 22:55
and that's mean, it's so important to understand. I mean, you know, as training behavior consultants like understanding the life stages, you know, when you understand the life stages of their a puppy, when they're a teenager, when they're you know, just the emotional stages and, yeah, so a couple things that I wanted to just bring up with this is One with behavior issues, it's also important for animal communicators to know when to refer if there's something behavioral going on that you know, know when to refer to either a behavior consultant or a veterinarian or those kind of things. You know, a good, ethical animal communicator will do that
JoLee 23:38
absolutely yes, and I've referred people to you and to asking, you know if, if somebody comes and says, you know, my cat's peeing outside the litter box, then the first question should be, have you seen your vet? Yeah, right. Is it a urinary tract infected infection? So, yeah, yeah, to definitely, to know the boundaries and to refer people when, when needed which there's such a vast network of people working with animals. You know, people that do massage for animals and their acupuncture. I mean, there's so many ways that animals can benefit from so many people who offer services and behaviorists are highly necessary, because I would say behavior issues are one of the primary issues with people and their pets that drive people crazy.
Chrissy 24:35
What I love to see is someone who is willing to work with a animal communicator and a behaviorist or a veterinary behaviorist or trainer, like working on all levels, the energetic level and the physical, mental, emotional levels, working on all those levels and working together, absolutely, yeah, yeah. And then the other thing that I. I just wanted to point out animal communicators that are medical intuitive or work specifically with lost animals, those are almost like specialties, right?
JoLee 25:08
They are specialties, for sure. Yes,
Unknown Speaker 25:11
yeah. So,
Chrissy 25:13
for example, there's a veterinarian, and then there's a veterinary behaviorist, and so the veterinary behaviorist has more of a specialty, yes. So I just wanted to point that out, not every animal communicator can do medical intuitive stuff or locate lost animals.
JoLee 25:30
That's right, that's right. So those are definitely niche rotates. Yeah, yeah.
Chrissy 25:36
Okay, so before we take a deep dive, which I feel like we kind of I want to talk about professional certifications and qualification, since this field is unregulated, just like dog training, anyone can say they're an animal communicator, or, you know, intuitive in a species communicator, and that can be very damaging if you're getting information from someone who isn't qualified and being ethical. Can you just talk about what someone should look for in an animal communicator or intuitive communicator?
JoLee 26:09
Well, definitely asking about their training and finding out where did they learn to do what they are doing, and just being curious about their background, longevity, I think is a really good sign, along with referrals. So looking at testimonials, I would say a lot of my client base has come from referrals and so asking around, who's your animal, what's your experience been, I think that can be a really helpful way as well. And just asking about being curious, I think that's the best way. So referrals are they're training referrals and and there are a lot of animal communicators out there that don't have certification, and some of them are good, but you don't want to throw dice. And so if you really want to focus on a certified animal communicator, look for one. They're often too,
Chrissy 27:17
yeah. And this is just super important, because I've known other dog trainers or behavior consultants that their client has worked with the animal communicator, and they were either given bad information or it wasn't helpful. Oh, yeah. And so I just important to, I guess, use, I mean, definitely look, ask them, just like with dog training, what's your you know, what's your certifications? Where your qualification? Where do you get your training? Yes, what's your experience? Just because I, you know, I've seen Yes, and I don't want to, I don't want to bash whatever, but I've seen some animal communicators give the head of information. You know, your dog wants to be dominant, or your dog needs to know who's in charge. Like, that's terrible information. You know? Yeah,
JoLee 28:06
no, it i and you see it more than I do, and I understand it can be very, very damaging. I do see people who've worked with dog trainers that are not respectful, that it's been very negative and has caused more problems, maybe than it even solved. And so I can imagine with animal communicators, that's the same thing. Yes, people need to be careful. Yes.
Chrissy 28:34
So it's the same thing with dog training. Look for qualifications are what's their training approach? You know, are they kind and
JoLee 28:43
effective? And effective? Exactly? Yes, yeah. Don't be afraid to get curious and ask questions. Yeah.
Chrissy 28:52
So it's been fascinating to see the latest science that's showing up with animal communication and inter species communication, like so the Institute of Noetic Sciences, Rupert, Sheldrake, you talked about, and then the telepathy tapes. Have you been following any of these? What are your thoughts and experiences around this?
JoLee 29:10
Well, I have a friend who follows the telepathy tape, so I've been hearing about it. And so there is science that does back it up. Telepathy tapes is about people who have these extraordinary, really intuitive abilities and validating that, and going for the science behind it, and looking for validation. I think it's fabulous, like I say it's been going on forever. We're kind of late to the game as humans, because it's been, I mean, most humans, it has been part of our biology. It's been part of our cultures. In other. Cultures is just in the western world right now, there's a lot of skepticism. I don't see skepticism as bad. I see skepticism as healthy. And I encourage people who are skeptic to check it out, to check out some of these things that people are saying might be true, because there is science behind it and it is real until you experience it yourself, or until there's a credible avenue that you trust. It can be a little hard to believe. I didn't used to believe in all this stuff either. I understand it and get curious and explore to find out the truth. Because the truth is, from my point of view, since I've been doing this so long, is that animals are communicating, and we can communicate with them without words, without verbal words, through telepathy. So it's real and human consciousness. You know, we are evolving as a species. We are becoming more fully who we truly are. We're a fraction of who we really are. The brain scientists understand a very small fraction of what happens in the brain. It's just a mystery. Part of that has to do with our abilities. That whole brain mass is not sitting there idly. It is. Part of it is interpreting intuition. So there's, there's a lot going on that we don't know about. So I just encourage people to find out for yourself. Keep asking questions, keep exploring. It's all very real to me. Yeah,
Chrissy 31:52
it's real, and it's fascinating. And then the more you get in there, you're like, oh my gosh, it's like, a little bit you have to do digestible pieces because,
JoLee 32:01
yes, because there is so much and we're growing so fast. I mean, I just think of how animal communication has taken off in the last 25 years. I compare it to acupuncture back in 2000 I remember I said something about acupuncture to my mom, and she's like, acupuncture needles, I mean. And a lot of people felt like that, like, I'm not going to have anybody sticking any needles in me. That's weird. Well, it's now so common. My mom's doctor actually recommended that she get acupuncture. And so that's in 25 years since she was considering it. You know, animal communication is very much like that. It's much more mainstream, and that's just going to happen more and more and more with the telepathy tapes and everything that people accepted that it's something that's really happening.
Chrissy 32:57
So can you just talk about how this, this is, we talked about it a little bit already, but how this is the skill that we need to develop, yes and work on. And it's, it's not just a special gift that only a certain amount of people have. Everybody has the ability. Yes, can you, I don't know if you want to dive a little deeper into that, of
JoLee 33:19
course. Well, I see it as a right brain left brain issue, intuition. The left brain is very much focused on logic and reason and making sense of our experience in the world. The right brain is very focused on creativity and on emotions and intuition and spirituality, things that cannot be rationally defined. And so our culture, our Western culture, is very left brained. We want things to make sense. We want everything to be rational and reasonable and logical. And intuition does not fall into any of those categories. And so to develop your intuition, it's helpful to be in the right brain, more which being in the right brain. Painting, when you're painting, you're in the right brain. It's creative. Now to paint, you have to use the left brain to get your supplies and to, you know, carve out your time. And I mean, so it uses both to actually paint, you need to have some organizational things, but when you're actually painting, it's right brain and it's creative. When you meditate or do any kind of spiritual practice that is right brained, because you can't do. Fine. It. You can't explain it. It's not reasonable, but it's real. And so the more people can do activities that are in their right brain, the more it will help develop their intuition, because they're more used to using the right brain. Singing is in the right brain. So it's like people who stutter, beach is left brained. People who stutter can sing without stuttering, because it's using a different part of the brain. It's using the right brain. So practicing some things that are right brained, I think, will help. There are also a lot of other things that help, you know, like I said, meditation, being aware of your brain frequency, doing things that bring you into the alpha state of brainwave frequency. Most people are in the beta frequency. And that's why teaching animal communication, we meditate, because meditation will get you into the alpha state, which is a higher vibration, and it's closer to spirituality, and it's easier to have that communication flow. So meditation is helpful with intuition. That's
Chrissy 36:15
interesting with the brain wave states, you know, they're, they're doing research on that, on people getting into those you know, the isn't there, like a theta beta and alpha, and then there's one more random website, Delta, yeah. And so they're doing research on how people can bring themselves into those specific states. It's pretty interesting.
JoLee 36:39
Meditation will take you into the alpha state and even into the theta state. Theta is right before you go to sleep. It's a brainwave frequency that is very blissful. And some people stay in the Alpha state. Some people who meditate a lot can be in the Alpha state all the time.
Chrissy 37:05
And what does that state look like? The different states? Do you know?
JoLee 37:08
Yes. So beta is active. You know, if you're you've got a test to take, or you need to all your mental abilities, or you're out driving, you're probably going to be in the beta state, because you need to be aware of what's going on around you. The Alpha state is a more peaceful state. It's a more tranquil state. It's not as alert. It's more in touch. To me, it's more in touch with the emotions, it's more in touch with. And emotions are right brains, so being able to feel your emotions, and that's another way to tap into intuition. The Alpha state, I think, is characterized just by greater inner peace. There's a relaxation, there's usually a slowing down of movements, an ability to be mindful. The Buddhists talk about mindfulness, and I think true mindfulness is the alpha state. You're just peacefully doing one thing at a time, and you're very tranquil as you're doing it. So I think that's alpha, the theta right before you go to sleep. That is not something you want to be in all the time if you're living your life, but you but it is a place you can go to connect with a deeper level of intuition, because there's, you know, people see images right before they go to sleep, and there's their clairvoyance is more open their images. Ability to receive images is more open in the theta state, so that in meditation can be a great place to access more of your intuition. Then, of course, delta is sleep. And so that's it's something,
Chrissy 39:03
yeah, okay. Well, those are, you know, great, practical ways to kind of get, get in touch with your intuition. And some people might say, I'm terrible at meditating, because a lot of people feel like they can't meditate. And maybe it's like, let's start with doing something movement creative, like walking in nature or singing, like you said, and then maybe do one minute of meditation, and then work up to work out from that,
JoLee 39:35
right? And I have someone I know who meditates through cycling. She's a very active person, and truly, her meditation comes in nature through through cycling and so and it's meditative. She goes into an alpha state when she does that. And I think people can do that through running as well. You know, they talk about the runner. High, and I know that has to do with endorphins and different things, but I think that it's very possible that they also go into the alpha state. I think a lot of people just being in nature, do naturally move into unless they're climbing a mountain or something, do they naturally move into an alpha state? It's a natural part of our experience. And we're doing it all the time. We do it every night. We go to sleep, we go to the alpha, then the theta, then the Delta. It. We're familiar with it. So it's kind of a stress reduction, I think, and movement is a valid way to access that alpha state, so people don't have to be sitting down meditating in a lotus position, saying, ohm. That's, you know, there, there are lots of ways of meditation, and some of them can be active. You know, what I
Chrissy 40:53
think is really fun is when you're in the dream, sleeping in the dream state, and, you know, you're dreaming, and you can get your dream. That's really fun.
JoLee 41:05
It is fun. It's called lucid dreaming, and it's a way to it's kind of a spiritual mastery kind of thing, to be able to have that consciousness and that awareness when you're sleeping, to know that you're in a dream and that you have control over your dream. It's, it is kind of fun, yeah, that's really doesn't it doesn't happen to me a lot, but it is fun when it happens. Yeah,
Chrissy 41:31
it doesn't happen a lot, but I can definitely remember the times that it has happened. Yes, yes, it's pretty cool. It is okay. So we talked about this a little bit before as well, but I feel like there's a shift happening in the world. Feel like you think there is too Do you want to talk about that? Or what do you think that is?
JoLee 41:50
Well, I think it's our evolution. I think we are reaching a place in our human evolution, which is our spiritual evolution. Because we are spiritual beings, and that is part of our where we're going. And so there's what I think is going on, is that we are being asked to choose between focusing on fear and focusing on love. I think it's really as simple as that, and it's not that simple, because we're all in fear about different things, and we all have various stages of love. And so those two experiences are dramatically different and are both really part of our lives, and some people don't realize they're in fear. People who are very controlling tend to be operating out of fear, and they don't. It doesn't seem like it's fear. They just want everything to be in their control. But that's fear based egos. People who are very connected with their egos, it's also fear based, and it doesn't manifest that way. So fear doesn't always show up as fear, but a lot of people are just in straight panic terror, and it's like, yeah, fear is huge, and they don't want to be but they don't know how to get out of it. So healing the fear and just recognizing that that's not really what the human body was intended to experience and that love will heal the fear. It's a matter of, sort of figuring out how that's going to happen, but that, I think, is the path for humanity is to recognize the fear and to turn instead to love and let the love heal the fear, then that's where we're going. That's my opinion.
Chrissy 43:46
Yeah, that's true. And then also getting curious and understanding, you know, have having empathy and curiosity and trying to understand another viewpoint or a reason for, let's say, your your dog's behavior, no, right?
JoLee 44:04
Yeah, and releasing judgment, I think that goes along with fear. Judgment is also rooted in fear. So people are very judgmental, and I include myself in the I try to release a lot of my judgments, but I have been very judgmental in my lifetime, and that's a real big block, I think, to where we're going spiritually on the planet, and so recognizing judgments and moving past them, and that can take lots of different forms. Yeah, I
Chrissy 44:36
mean even judging yourself. Yes, you're your own biggest critic,
JoLee 44:42
absolutely yes. And so being kind to yourself and finding self love. Self love has been a big place of growth, spiritual growth the last few decades. And so really exploring that, what does that mean to truly love your. What does it mean to be truly kind to yourself? What does it mean to have self compassion? But those are all places where we're going and leaving the fear and judgment and all behind.
Chrissy 45:12
So in your experience and all the readings you've done, what what lessons have animals taught us?
JoLee 45:19
I think it's just what we've been talking about. I think that it's the unconditional love. I really think that that's the primary lesson we're learning as humans. Animals are already there, and they love unconditionally without thinking about it is just part of who they are and part of their gift to us, and so the more we can love unconditionally and forgive. Animals forgive all the time. There's so much in present time they don't hold on to to past difficulties. If it was unpleasant, they may remember it and not want to have that experience again, but if they know that their person forgot something that was important and they don't want to do it again, and they know their person loves them, they're going to forgive in a heartbeat, much quicker than we are and so unconditional love and forgiveness, I think, are what they teach us every day, all the time,
Chrissy 46:28
and that's almost like the higher self. Think that when we're looking at coming from a training and behavior standpoint, dogs, just on the physical and emotional level, create associations with negative or positive things. So I think it's looking at it at different levels of what they're teaching us, and I with clients that I've worked with, but the things that we're working on with the dog, the humans life changes. You know, their mindset changes, the way they approach working with her dog changes so the human changes as well. So I almost feel like the dog teaches the human a different way to be. I know that happened with my dogs.
JoLee 47:12
Yeah, yes, it's it's true, and I don't know how much of that is conscious on dogs. You know, who knows how this whole universe is kind of made up, but yes, that I agree that that happens often, that there's some kind of synchronicity and some symbiosis, that where the human and the animal grow together.
Chrissy 47:39
Yes, if the human is open to it,
Speaker 1 47:43
I think that's a key factor, right there.
JoLee 47:47
Get it? Yeah, you're right, yes, because not everybody's ready and not everybody's willing, right? Yeah. So
Chrissy 47:54
we've already talked about ways that people can tap into their own intuitive abilities, but I think one common experience that people have is trusting the information that that they get and interpreting it, and not second guessing the information that comes in, yes, right away. And, you know, we've talked about that a little bit too, but I'm still working on that, you know, trusting the information, yeah, and interpreting it. And that's the practice
JoLee 48:20
it is, it's still, it's part of the evolution, and yes, like you say, the practice, it's the trust in yourself, again, I think it comes from the validation. The more you practice, the more there's someone who says, Oh, well, that's interesting. How would they have known that? And that person can validate just where you are and what you've said. It happens organically. I think, for a person to trust themselves, it's not there in the beginning with most people, and so accepting that you're going to doubt yourself and that trust, it's going to be it's going to take time for that to be there and just keep going. Just keep working on it. Yeah,
Chrissy 49:15
I think accepting on so many levels, even with dogs that we're working with, where they're having, like, showing behaviors that can be scary. You know, it's like, you're accepting this behavior, not that it's okay, but you're like, Okay, I accept that this is happening. Now how, what can we do to find the root cause of the issue, or what can we do to help change this behavior. So it's, it's, it's accepting that it's happening, and then figuring out a way to to help,
JoLee 49:48
right, right? That's love too. It's absolutely love, just having going into a session with compassion and love can. Change everything, even if things don't shift substantially, things can shift enough that the person in the animal can see a new way, there's some hope, and that then can bring about all kinds of changes. It's not like we have to fix things. We really can't fix things. It's up to the person in the and the dog, but we can bring insights or shine a new light in a certain place and help there be a focus in a new way of looking at something that then will open doors and will allow for resolution. So
Chrissy 50:42
how do you because people are like, Am I making this up? Is this in all in my head? How do you differentiate between the information that's coming in from outside of you versus it being in your own head? How do you do
JoLee 50:56
that? Well, the problem is when the left brain starts wanting to run the show. So to be able to receive good, accurate information, I need to be in my right brain. When I'm in my right brain and I'm receiving information, it's all a surprise. I get the information. I'm like, Whoa, wonder. It's just, it's just a picture, it's just some information that I'm like, Oh, well, that's interesting, and then I'll share that and but I know if it's a surprise, I would never think of that. Then that's spiritual information. If somebody's talking about, say, a health issue, and my mind is going, Oh, well, maybe they need acupuncture, or maybe they need something that, oh, and I read this the other day, and if my mind is going, and I know my mind is going and it's trying to figure something out, is trying to fix it is trying to find the answer. That's my ego. That's my mind, and it's not spiritual information. I'm in my left brain. My left brain knows nothing about intuition. Can't understand it. It makes no sense, and so I just need to recognize, ah, I'm in my mind. I'm in my left brain. I need to set all that aside. Every time I recognize that which it happens, of course, I just recognize I say, Oh, mine, thank you so much for giving me all that information. And I just set it aside. And I go back into my meditation and my right brain. I say I'm going to wait for the spiritual information to come so it's recognizing Are you in your right brain or your left brain? And it doesn't take that much to figure it out. We're mostly in our left brain during the daytime, and so being in your right brain is a different experience. It's easy to see when, oh, I'm in my right brain and everything's Yeah, and I'm getting the information, then the left brain comes charging in, and it's different. You know what I'm talking about. We all experience it,
Chrissy 53:15
yeah. I think a few things too that from my experience. One is it comes in, like, really fast, yeah, like, just automatic, like, you sometimes it's so fast that you miss it, yes, right? So one is, it just comes in really, like, before you even or maybe finish answering the question or asking the question, yes, yeah. And then the second one is, like, you said, it's a surprise. You're like, oh, well,
Speaker 2 53:44
that's strange. Yeah, yes.
Chrissy 53:47
And then the third one is not forcing it, letting it come to you. Yes, just let it. It's like, just a stillness, neutral, like it just comes to you. Yeah, there's no effort,
JoLee 54:00
yes, exactly, because people will try to go get the information, you know. They'll try to go to the pet and say, Tell me, tell me, you know. And there is effort there. And the pet is usually like, Who is this person in my space? And I wish they'd go away, you know. So being in your space, receiving the information, letting it come to you, being patient. I sat with one dog for like, 10 minutes, and the dog just wouldn't talk with me. He was afraid, and he was shy, and I just kind of talked to the person and said, Your dog's a little shy, and you know, we're just gonna it took me a while to build the dog's trust enough that the dog would actually communicate with me, and so being patient, not taking it personally, and waiting and it will come, even if the dog, when the dog finally started talking to me, she was behind her person, kind of poking her head around the side. Right, giving me the answers, you know, and hiding behind the person, it was so cute, and that's how she felt safe and but she was able to share the information that way. So just allowing the animals to be who they are, and not not forcing it like you say, is the key. I think another
Chrissy 55:18
huge aspect is the ethical part of this, being ethical about what you're doing. So first getting permission from the human and the dog, oh, yes, or animal to make sure it's okay to
Speaker 2 55:33
talk with them, absolutely, yeah.
Chrissy 55:37
And then the the way you do it, I typically like to, if it's a new person, I just get the dog's name and a picture. I don't want a whole lot of information, because I don't want, I don't want that to affect the reading. And so it's really making sure that you're setting setting the session up. So it's done in a way that, quote, unquote, you're not cheating, right? Yes. What ethical aspects can you think of? Well,
JoLee 56:11
I think you bring up a good one with making sure that both the person and the pet are in agreement to the session. The main one that I encounter is I remember when I was starting out, I had a client pay for a reading for her niece and aces dog. And so she did and I gave the the reading, and I recorded the reading and gave it to the niece. Then I talked with the client, and she said so, and she wanted to hear all about it. And I said, I can't talk with you about if, if you want to hear about the reading, you need to talk to your niece, right? And I've had clients who give the recording to people, that's great. They can give that recording to whoever they want, but it they are giving the recording. It's not coming from me. Everything that happens in a reading with me is confidential. People are very private about their relationships with their pets, right? They don't want other people to know. I've even had clients who have referred me, and it's such a sensitive topic that I don't even tell the person who referred me that I had a session with the person that they had referred so enormously confidential. There are people who don't want other people to know they've had the session, because they don't want the person quizzing them on it. I I'm just very, very honoring that whole very, really tender and intimate animal communicator client relationship, that's how I encounter it. Mostly, yeah, yeah,
Chrissy 58:07
no, that's super important. And then also, some people, some people are maybe embarrassed about, you know, yes, yeah. Like, you don't want to tell anyone that they had, you know, session with the communicator exactly. You
JoLee 58:21
never know. You never know. That's why I have just kind of picked up some of those things over the years that, oh, there's a little energy around this, or there's some privacy issues that I just tend not unless somebody says something to me, I generally don't share information from I do in my classes, but I don't say who it is. It's all anonymous. So it's just honoring that that that intimate communication, and keeping it intimate and confidential. I know
Chrissy 58:59
you've shared a couple stories, but you have a story that's undeniable, like an undeniable experience? Well, I
JoLee 59:07
have one that was really interesting, and to me it was undeniable. We'll see what you think. I was reading a cat maple, and she lived on a second story in a in a condo with her people, and we had a really nice communication. I could tell she was enormously smart and very curious. And so I really enjoyed talking with her, and she answered all of her people's questions pretty quickly, and then she said, we still had time left. She said, I have a few questions for you. And so I said, Oh, okay, what are they? So they were just some general questions about, you know, why don't why can't I have more freedom and different things like. Do I have to stay on the second floor deck? Why can't I go down to the grass, you know? But the grass area wasn't fenced in, and so, you know, just explaining some pretty simple things, and she was satisfied with the answers, and then she said, Are you going to come live with us? And I just looked at her, and I said, No, I'm not going to come live with you. But I was talking with her people, of course, and I said she wants to know if I'm going to come live with you. And I told her, No, I'm not. And so they were baffled, you know, like, why would she say such a thing as I was and they just both kind of looked at each other and were kind of and then the woman started laughing, and she said, a couple of months ago, my cousin, who's female, sat in the chair you're sitting in, and talked with maple a lot. Was very engaged with her, and maple was just transfixed with her, and she stayed for a couple of hours. And at the end of it, they all decided that her cousin would move in with them, and was currently living with them. And so she the woman just got that. Oh, here's another woman paying attention to Maple sitting in the same chair. And you know, are you gonna come? I mean, it made perfect sense to Maple that she would that question, and it made perfect sense to the woman and her husband as well. So that, to me, is like, Where would that come from? That was something that made perfect sense to her, that was out of the blue,
Chrissy 1:01:50
yeah, well, it's funny. My, my trainer brain is like, Oh, she has an association with, you know, a woman sitting in a chair, you know, having a conversation, and then they moved in, and so she's like, Oh, anybody who does that's gonna
JoLee 1:02:05
That's right. Her, her, her question made perfect sense.
Speaker 2 1:02:10
That's funny, yeah. Oh, okay,
Chrissy 1:02:14
so someone's starting, and they're skeptical. For me, I had to first, like be open to it, sure, and then I had to practice and get validation. And then, for for me, the belief started setting in. So for someone who's just getting started, what are key aspects to to doing this? Would you say to starting it? Yeah.
JoLee 1:02:38
So there are lots of books out there where people, animal communicators, very good animal communicators, guide people through how to do it themselves. And so I would suggest that somebody get a book by somebody who's really good that they trust, and start practicing it like I say that, yes, being open to it, but it's really the practice. It's the actual seeing that it's real in your pet and so that will come from experience. And so figure out a way that somebody suggests that you might communicate with your pet and start practicing it. People's pets will be so happy because, like I say, they are communicating with us all the time, and they're trying to get our attention there. They just do Acrobat skills to try to get their message across to us, and so for us to make it easier for them, where we are picking up their pictures, where they are able to communicate in ways that make sense to us with our natural intuition. They are so relieved, like, I don't have to work so hard. And people are are getting you. It's like we are speaking their language. That's really what it is. So it's like learning a new language, but it's a language that your pet's already speaking. So I encourage people to just do it. Just think of
Chrissy 1:04:21
such a huge, important piece of it is to is working through our own stuff as well. So we're not projecting our thoughts or feelings onto our animals and just making sure that the information is coming from them, and we're not just projecting stuff onto them. Yes,
JoLee 1:04:39
that's true, and I do see that a lot people will feel guilty about something. So I had a session with a woman not too long ago, and her question, her only quote, we had had a number of sessions before, and her only question this session was, how can I make my dog happy? What. Missing. How can I help her? And it was just basic stuff. Her dogs, I don't know, like, eight years old or something. It's just the two of them. They had a great relationship. But the woman traveled a lot, but she had a great house sitter. The same house sitter all the time, and the dog was like lying in the sun with you petting me, that will make me happy, and these certain kind of treats that really makes me happy, and going outside, so lying on the Sun inside, you know, like in a sunbeam in a window, and having you pet me, being outside and eating treats, and having you pet me, that makes me really, really happy, you know? I mean, it's just all this basic stuff, and there were some other things, but it was all just, you know? And at the end of the session, she said, You have no she said, I can do all this. She says, You You have no idea what a relief this is to me. She lives in California, and she says, I have friends who take their dogs on five mile hikes up mountains, and they are trying to convince me that I am somehow being a bad pet owner and depriving my dog from these experiences by not taking her hiking on these trips. And so I said, Oh, well, let's see what your dog has to say about this. And she just looks and she's like, I don't want to do that. I have no interest in doing that. She's like, I like lying around. I'm the and so there were, she said, Do you know those dogs feet hurt when they come home, but I, you know, I you check in with the dogs. They're like, Yeah, my feet hurt for a little bit, but boy, was it worth it, because they're love it, and they love being with their people. But the person didn't want to do it, but she felt guilty and she was projecting on that somehow she was keeping her dog from an experience that all dogs wanted, but it wasn't so objection, and especially with guilt, people have a lot of guilt around things where their dogs often just adjust to things, so people's guilt is often misplaced.
Chrissy 1:07:24
So do you have anything you would like to share with our audience, anything else that comes to mind that we haven't talked about?
JoLee 1:07:30
I just encourage people to tell your pets every day how much you love them. Yeah, just to communicate that it means the world to them, even though they know it. People get busy, and to have that reassurance for pets that you just you love them, and even if there are issues, you still love them. And to express that, I just encourage people to do that. The animals can't hear that enough. And it's not like animals don't know it, they know it, but to have that actual expression just makes them deliriously happy.
Chrissy 1:08:17
Yeah, and the intention behind the words, because so not just like, not even just saying the words, but the intention behind it, they can feel that
JoLee 1:08:27
absolutely, that it's authentic, that there's an emotion with that yes, not to yep, that's very good point, not just the words, but that actual authentic feeling. Yes.
Chrissy 1:08:40
Well, thank you for coming on. If people want to connect with you or talk with you, what's the best way to get a hold of you?
JoLee 1:08:46
Well, most people find me through my website. I have two websites for animal communication. It's the pet dash communication.com, so P, E, T, dash communication with an n.com and no s. So that's that's a main place. People get in touch with me, but I get a lot of emails. You can find my email through there. It's Jolie at Pet dash communication.com or people can call me however people would like to
Unknown Speaker 1:09:23
connect. Yeah, okay, we'll
Chrissy 1:09:26
put those in the show notes. Okay, well, thank you so much for coming on. This was fun to talk about. Oh
JoLee 1:09:32
Chrissy, this is fabulous. I so appreciate you inviting me. Been a great conversation.
Chrissy 1:09:38
Thank you for joining us today. I hope you discovered a valuable nugget you can implement right away with your dog. If you enjoyed the episode, please follow, rate and share with fellow dog lovers who might benefit. Don't forget to take our How well do you know your dog quiz? You'll find the link in the show notes until next week. Happy tales. You.
